[casual_games] INPUT REQUESTED: 2010 IGDA Casual Game SIG Programs

[Juan Gril]

No, you are mistaken, you should be playing more social games. Yoville
requires a backend server, has persistence. Same with Farm Town.

You seem interested to classify the games by its genres. Which is fine. In a
White Paper however, it is my opinion to classify games by its production
requirements. Different types of interactions are issues in game design. You
seem to not agree on the fact that a single player game with social elements
is not a social game. However, 10 million players playing Bejeweled Blitz
every month don't seem to agree with you. It's the social elements in
Bejeweled Blitz which make it a a great game.



On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 11:49 AM, Maxim Jankov <golergka at gmail.com> wrote:


> The browser-based games can require heavy server-side programming,

> especially with players moving in the persistent 2d world in real time and

> interacting with each other (take runescape, for example). One of the games

> I've been working at (kor.ru, wow-like gameplay in 2d on the flash

> platform) employed team of 2 gameplay server programmers (python), 2 system

> level programmers (C++) and lead programmer that took care of the database.

> Most part of social games, however, features very simple (to implement in

> code) mechanics with no requiements for the real-time PvP interactions and

> allowed reaction time of several seconds (that's what it takes MafiaWars to

> load my battle results). And single-player games usually don't feature any

> client-server mechanics at all.

> Of course, traditional browser-based games and flash games can easily

> feature facebook integration to some degree (publish highscore in update),

> but that doesn't make them social games. Posting screenshots to bioware

> social network doesn't make the Dragon Age a social game either; it is

> unique game design and game experience that makes the game "social".

>

> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 10:04 PM, Juan Gril <juangril at jojugames.com>wrote:

>

>> I see your points, but I disagree on both counts. First of all social

>> games cannot depend on virality anymore: marketing is becoming absolutely

>> mandatory and there is no successful social game today (10M+) that hasn't

>> spent more than 6 figures in marketing ads.

>>

>> The complexity of social games is growing. Browser based MMOs should

>> actually use social networks in order to expand their audience. There is

>> absolutely no rule in Facebook that says social games should just be about

>> farms or cafes. Castle Age and Band of Heroes are examples of people who are

>> trying to serve the same audience who is playing browser MMOs today, and

>> they already have more users than most of the browsers MMOs out there. If I

>> would be doing a browser MMO, I would definitely include in my list of

>> features how I'm going to integrate my game into social networks.

>>

>> And to your second point, if you pitch any advergame or single player

>> flash game in 2010 to any publisher or advertiser and you don't include at

>> least a basic facebook connect like connectivity, you'll probably lose the

>> bid. Why not do it? It takes 2-3 days of work for a dev to integrate a

>> single player social game on Facebook (to promote player's achievements for

>> example). It's a good promotion mechanism that doesn't cost any money.

>>

>> Why would flash games require a different kind of developer? People who

>> have done flash based games with multiplayer or community based connectivity

>> can tackle any type of social game. They have a very similar set of

>> technical requirements.

>>

>> Juan

>>

>>

>>

>> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 10:37 AM, Maxim Jankov <golergka at gmail.com>wrote:

>>

>>> Actually, social games in networks and traditional browser-based MMO

>>> games can be very different; social games depend on virality (low cost of

>>> customer acquisition), simple casual gameplay with many elements relying on

>>> real time (energy restoration mechanics, or offline player-player

>>> interactions) and not so high ARPPU per user, when browser-based games tend

>>> to be more hardcore (ogame), acquiring most part of the users from ads, but

>>> relying on much stable and loyal core user base. Browser-based games like

>>> war of dragons can have ARPPU as high as $200 per month, and typical user

>>> lifespan in the project is much longer then in facebook games.

>>> These differences may look minor, but these kinds of games actually

>>> require different design approach and overall development strategy.

>>> Also, I think that flash single-player games deserve their own category.

>>> Most part of them are very low-budget, ad-driven, with focus on gameplay

>>> innovation and low production values. They, also, require a very different

>>> kind of developer.

>>>

>>> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 8:02 PM, Juan Gril <juangril at jojugames.com>wrote:

>>>

>>>> Hey Dave :). Here are my opinions:

>>>>

>>>> Types of casual games (ranked):

>>>>

>>>>    1. Social Games, Ad-Supported Web Games and Freemium Browser Games.

>>>>    These three are the same. A lot of the ad-supported games for 2010 come with

>>>>    some type of Social integration using APIs as OpenSocial or Facebook

>>>>    Connect. It's proven that ads alone are not the bulk of the revenues, so you

>>>>    need the freemium business model in order to survive. And anyone who is

>>>>    doing a freemium browser game should take their time to do some basic social

>>>>    integration in order to spread the word.

>>>>

>>>>    Lastly, even advergaming clients are requiring social integration

>>>>    now.

>>>>

>>>>    2. PC Downloads

>>>>    3. iPhone Games and General Mobile Games (these two are similar and

>>>>    should not be separated as the bulk of the mobile game sales are on touch

>>>>    based devices. I would stop calling them iPhone games though, as Android

>>>>    devices are not iPhones).

>>>>    4. Console Downloads.

>>>>

>>>>

>>>> Facilitate discussion: a new version of the White Paper may help as a

>>>> reference with the changes suggested above. The quaterly has always been one

>>>> of the best in the industry. The list is fine as long is not full of "how do

>>>> I get my game to the portals?" messages.

>>>>

>>>> Cheers,

>>>>

>>>> Juan

>>>>

>>>>

>>>>

>>>>

>>>>

>>>> _______________________________________________

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>>>>

>>>>

>>>

>>>

>>> --

>>> Maxim "golergka" Yankov

>>> Game Designer

>>> Playnatic Entertainment, Moscow, Russia

>>> e-mail: max at playnatic.com

>>> Phone: +7-903-155-75-14

>>> ICQ: 207535652

>>> Skype: golergka

>>>

>>> _______________________________________________

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>>>

>>>

>>

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>>

>>

>

>

> --

> Maxim "golergka" Yankov

> Game Designer

> Playnatic Entertainment, Moscow, Russia

> e-mail: max at playnatic.com

> Phone: +7-903-155-75-14

> ICQ: 207535652

> Skype: golergka

>

> _______________________________________________

> Casual_Games mailing list

> Casual_Games at igda.org

> http://www.igda.org/casual-subscribe

> Archive: http://www.igda.org/casual-subscribe

> Archive Search:

> http://www.google.com/coop/cse?cx=010373383720242846960%3Az3tdwggxil8

> List FAQ:

> http://www.igda.org/wiki/index.php/Casual_Games_SIG/Casual_Games_List_FAQ

>

>

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