[casual_games] Gameplay patents

[Tom Hubina]

Seaward Ho! has similarities to other titles from which it drew inspiration,
though we think there are definitely unique aspects to it. That said, yes,
it is a refinement on past titles by others.
 
If you'll allow for my hypocrisy for a bit on that title (and arguably on
other titles I've done) we spend a great deal of time working out new
mechanics for things. This is mostly because we're on mobile and new
mechanics are frequently needed to overcome the various platform limitations
and old mechanics don't translate well to the control systems in mobile, but
it's also because we feel it's very important to bring something new to the
table.
 
Both the pain and pleasure of mobile is that in many ways it's the wild
west. While we have experiences gained from previous platforms to draw upon,
there's a huge opportunity (necessity) for innovation and the ability to
create something no one has seen before. This is also part of the promise in
casual/web downloadable, but the commoditization of content through massive
cloning and high churn is going to absolutely kill any rewards for
creativity.
 
Tom


  _____  

From: casual_games-bounces at igda.org [mailto:casual_games-bounces at igda.org]
On Behalf Of Tim Conkling
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 11:39 AM
To: IGDA Casual Games SIG Mailing List
Subject: Re: [casual_games] Gameplay patents


"Isn't it better that we have people focused on making
things that no one has seen before, instead of focused on how to reproduce
the last thing that was a hit so they can cash in for a quick buck?"

No. Iteration and refinement are necessary and important as well. Every once
in a while, we see a game that "no one else has seen before" and a new genre
is born. But the world would be a far poorer place if id was the only
company allowed to make a first-person shooter, just as it would be a poorer
place if the only stories involving love and loss came from Shakespeare. 

This isn't meant to be a cheap shot -- honest! -- but how do you reconcile
your proposal of "you're going to need to make something new if you want to
make a game" with a game like Seaward Ho (a game I found on your website)? I
haven't played it, so I don't know for sure, but it appears to be expanding
on ideas put forth in earlier games like Pirates! and Elite. (And there's
nothing wrong with that!) 

Game designers -- like authors, musicians, painters, filmmakers -- stand on
the shoulders of giants. Artists who make lasting contributions to culture
don't do so by jealously protecting their great ideas, and they don't do so
in isolation. Great creations will always spawn cheap imitations, and
ham-handed use of the (broken) US patent system won't change that. 


On 2/14/07, Tom Hubina <tomh at mofactor.com> wrote: 

Here's the deal ...

If id Software had wanted to croak everyone and not let anyone else make a
new FPS, then that's their right. They INVENTED it!!!

Honestly, I'm glad games like Duke 3D and Unreal Tournament were made but as

someone who is trying hard to come up with original game play designs I
don't like the idea that people can take what I've spent a ton of time and
energy developing and slap some different graphics on it and release it on 
portals where it competes with my titles. What I really care about is the
ability for the person who invents something to be able to say how that
invention can be exploited by others. In id's case, they were licensing 
their technology and they were better at making that tech than anyone else
for a very long time. They were smart enough to know that licensing that
tech was worth more money that preventing people from making competing 
products.

In casual, there isn't any tech to speak of. It's 100% game play, and it
gets ripped off constantly without any improvements or changes. The
relatively low cost to create titles means that it's MUCH worse in casual 
than in the days of the FPS.

My question is, would we have gotten to Half-Life and Counterstrike earlier
if people weren't so busy ripping off Doom / Quake / etc? Necessity is the
mother of invention, and if just doing a copy isn't enough you have to look 
for something "more".

And how about this as a follow up question: If you can't make a copy of what
someone else has done, you're going to need to make something new if you
want to make a game. Isn't it better that we have people focused on making 
things that no one has seen before, instead of focused on how to reproduce
the last thing that was a hit so they can cash in for a quick buck?

How about if publishers couldn't fund that kind of stuff (unless they want 
to pay for a license), and instead the only thing they could put their money
into was original/innovative content? How many great ideas that never got
the chance to be made would suddenly find it possible to get funding? 

Tom
(this is mostly a theoretical debate as it's based on the premise that we
have a revised patent structure for gaming content)



> -----Original Message-----

> From: casual_games-bounces at igda.org

> [mailto:casual_games-bounces at igda.org] On Behalf Of Lennard Feddersen

> Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 10:12 AM

> To: IGDA Casual Games SIG Mailing List 

> Subject: Re: [casual_games] Gameplay patents

>

> I don't agree with your last sentence Adam.  We got from Wolf

> 3d to Unreal Tournament - IMHO pretty clearly a good thing as

> far as FPS players are concerned - because id software did 

> not (in fact, quite likely Carmack created some of his

> competitors with his amazing code release policy) stop future

> innovation and enhancement upon which consumers got more and

> better products that they seemed happy to purchase.  Many 

> people were employed and new and strong companies were built.

>

> IMHO this is the strength of capitalism - somebody makes

> something that sticks so many people dive in and figure out

> how to make a better mouse trap.  The very powerful computers 

> we are now all enjoying came about because of this very

> marketplace mechanic - if early developers had been given

> technology patents that were too broad then we most surely

> would not be where we are today. 

>

> Lennard Feddersen

> CEO, Rusty Axe Games, Inc.

> www.RustyAxe.com

>

> Lennard at RustyAxe.com

> P. 250-635-7623 F. 1-309-422-2466 

> P. July & August 518-863-2317

> 5014 Walsh, Terrace, BC, Canada, V8G-4H2

>

>

>

> Adam Martin wrote:

> > On 14/02/07, Tom Hubina <tomh at mofactor.com  <mailto:tomh at mofactor.com> >

wrote:

> >

> >> We _should_ be able to patent UNIQUE game play. We

> _should_ be able

> >> to leverage some form of legal protection to stem the tide

> of rampant

> >> copycats that is absolutely destroying the casual games 

> industry (buy

> >> me a drink at GDC and I'll talk your ear off about this topic).

> >> However, the current

> >>

> >

> > I'll bite. Where/when can I find you? :) 

> >

> > I'll wager that the much faster and more appropriate

> solution to the

> > copycat problem is for the retail market to improve. My turn at a

> > provocative statement until GDC: claiming that the ease of cloning 

> > games is destroying the casual games industry is like claiming that

> > the second-hand games market is destroying the mainstream games

> > industry - both are merely the customers showing that the 

> industry has

> > fundamentally misunderstood what their market actually

> wants, or has

> > fundamentally failed to satisfy the needs effectively.

> >

> > Adam

> > _______________________________________________ 

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