[casual_games] Casual Game Framework

[Kef Sensei]

Thanks everyone for the great advice.
Regards
Eli


On 5/29/07, Tom Hubina <tomh at mofactor.com> wrote:

>

>  The original poster asked about casual games, and based on the engine

> choices he was considering seems to be looking at the PC/Mac market. Others

> have already covered what I would say on that topic and I don't feel like

> repeating them. Both you and the other poster suggested that having the

> engine selection should be, at least in part, based on availability of a

> mobile version of the engine and I was disagreeing with that part.

>

> I don't have a suggestion for a useful, unified mobile/pc/console engine

> just like I don't have a suggestion for building a perpetual motion machine

> and I don't think it's unreasonable to debunk folks trying to tout such a

> thing as a practical solution. Strip mobile from that list and you can say

> whatever you want ;)

>

> I overheard this type of talk at the casual/mobile conference in LA last

> week and I wrote it off as an aberration. Now that I'm hearing a couple of

> people here suggesting it as an important consideration I realize that this

> is something that should probably be nipped in the bud before folks that

> aren't familiar with mobile start believing it and the nonsense spreads.

>

> That said .. If you want me to rephrase my objection into a

> more constructive form ... here ya go -

>

> If you're creating a casual title and being able to take it to mobile

> (eventually) is something that matters to you, then you should write it in

> C++ and avoid 3D. The underlying engine doesn't matter because ALL of the UI

> and resource management will be massively rewritten. The benefit of going

> with C/C++ is that you can typically bring your gameplay mechanic code over

> to BREW/WIPI and J2ME with less effort than if you're coming from something

> like Flash, although with Flash 9 things are a bit closer.

>

> Tom

>

>  ------------------------------

> *From:* casual_games-bounces at igda.org [mailto:

> casual_games-bounces at igda.org] *On Behalf Of *E. D. Bass

> *Sent:* Tuesday, May 29, 2007 9:52 AM

> *To:* IGDA Casual Games SIG Mailing List

> *Subject:* Re: [casual_games] Casual Game Framework

>

> Any SUGGESTIONS as to what he should use, Tom?

>

> Countering is one thing, carping is another...It's about trying to

> help. I don't think anyone on this list thinks there's an all in one

> solution, but you have to start somewhere to see what suits you, and your

> team.

>

> Then you move forward.

>

> Tom Hubina wrote:

>

> If anyone tells you that an engine can cleanly support (or even remotely

> cleanly) PC, Consoles, and Mobile devices you should look for the snake oil

> that he's also selling. More than likely the only "mobile devices" they

> support are PDAs and Smartphones and not the hundreds of millions of mobile

> phones out there where you can actually make some money ;)

>

> You can 100% forget about any kind of all-in-one solution for 2D games. The

> only thing close would be 3D stuff, and that represents a tiny portion of

> the mobile market right now. But even that's something I would have to call

> bullshit on given that so many of the devices don't support things like

> floating point, and that you would need an engine that supports both J2ME

> (JSR-184) and C++ (BREW/OpenGL ES).

>

> And that's just the engine part. Once you factor in the idea that quality

> games on mobile are frequently quite a bit different than their PC/Console

> counterparts due to user interface, play time expectations, etc you quickly

> realize that anyone who says they have an engine that supports all three

> from the same code base has never actually made a successful mobile title.

>

> (sorry to be harsh, but I've seen a lot of this nonsense going around

> lately and no one seems to be countering it)

>

> Tom

>

>  ------------------------------

> *From:* casual_games-bounces at igda.org [

> mailto:casual_games-bounces at igda.org <casual_games-bounces at igda.org>] *On

> Behalf Of *gmail.com

> *Sent:* Tuesday, May 29, 2007 7:28 AM

> *To:* 'IGDA Casual Games SIG Mailing List'

> *Subject:* Re: [casual_games] Casual Game Framework

>

>  Hi,

>

> I agree completely agree with Eric. You really need a full package if you

> intend to develop for PC, Consoles, Mobile devices, etc. I recommend that

> you give a look at Mobex3D (www.mobex3D.com <http://www.mobex3d.com/>),

> it's a great engine for PC, Mac and mobile devices. It's one of the best

> engine available for mobile devices today.

>

> Hope this advice helped.

>

> Best regards,

>

> David Opresnik

>

>  ------------------------------

>

> *Od:* casual_games-bounces at igda.org [mailto:casual_games-bounces at igda.org<casual_games-bounces at igda.org>]

> *Namesto *E. D. Bass

> *Poslano:* 29. maj 2007 16:00

> *Za:* IGDA Casual Games SIG Mailing List

> *Zadeva:* Re: [casual_games] Casual Game Framework

>

> Just wanted to add my 1.0025 cents.

>

> My crew recently ran up against this issue, and choosing a solid dev

> package was a good deal more difficult than i had imagined.

>

> I normally don't offer unsolicited advice, so do forgive...

>

> Firstly, think of your long term goal and long term development scheme

> if you intend on developing for PC, Console, Mobile devices, or Web-based,

> Choose a package that can either do all of those things.

>

> Do get stuck with a package that will cause you headaches when you decided

> to

> jump platforms. Our solution was TGE for everything but web, and for that

> we

> chose Flash Professional.

>

> TGE for price, support, community, and the fact that the guys at Garage

> Games actually

> answer their phones AND give great advice and support. And Flash, because

> you just

> cannot beat it for fast, fluid, cross compatible game dev.

>

> So, thats my story and I'm sticking to it, good luck Bro.. its all worth

> it.. trust me!

>

> Peace and Prosperity,

> Eric Bass

> Concrete Alchemy Mediaworks

>

>

> James Terry wrote:

>

> 1-Is there any impact on the selected technology on a Publisher's point of

> view? Do they prefer any technology over other?

>

> A lot of publishers favor their in-house technology if available,

> Playground SDK, PopCap Framework, Torque Game Builder, etc.

>

> 2-What do you think about  XNA for a casual games?

>

> Like others have said, XNA hasn't matured yet, and it does not support Mac

> at all (which is a large outlet for a casual game)

>

> 3-Any experience on using a publishers framework (PopCap Games Framework)

> and then publishing with others?

>

> Both the PopCap and Playfirst SDK can be used on projects that end up

> getting published through someone else, or even self-published

>

> 4-Any other suggestions?

>

> Check out Playfirst SDK, PopCap Framework, Torque Game Builder, Unity (if

> you have a Mac) and see which one is most useful for what you want to make.

> >From what I've seen, its faster to build a Prototype using Unity or TGB

> since they have a heavy scripting component while PopCap and Playfirst will

> stick you with a lot of C++, but TGB and Unity both cost a bit, while PopCap

> and Playfirst are free

>

>  *James R. Terry*

> Yatec, LLC

> 11606 Southfork, Suite 300

> Baton Rouge, Louisiana 70816

> (225) 274-1550 Ext. 136

> www.yatecgames.com

>

>

>  ------------------------------

>

> *From:* casual_games-bounces at igda.org [

> mailto:casual_games-bounces at igda.org <casual_games-bounces at igda.org>] *On

> Behalf Of *Kef Sensei

> *Sent:* Monday, May 28, 2007 9:35 AM

> *To:* casual_games at igda.org

> *Subject:* [casual_games] Casual Game Framework

>

> We are an outsourcing company and we are developing our first game of our

> own. We are creating a playable demo for submission to publishers and we are

> considering sevral technologies.

> We have started with XNA hoping to go through Microsoft path but we found

> many incompatibilities with Graphic Cards so we are considering other

> options such as PopCap Games Framework.

> Some questions:

>

> 1-Is there any impact on the selected technology on a Publisher's point of

> view? Do they prefer any technology over other?

>

> 2-What do you think about  XNA for a casual games?

>

> 3-Any experience on using a publishers framework (PopCap Games Framework)

> and then publishing with others?

>

> 4-Any other suggestions?

>

> Thanks for the feedback...

>

> Regards

> Eli

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------

>

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