[games_access] personas and scenarios

Lynn Marentette lynnvm at carolina.rr.com
Fri May 25 13:25:01 EDT 2007


 
Hi.

I am not sure if I sent my last post directly to Eelke or to the list- sorry
for any duplication.

For those who aren't familiar with personas/scenarios, the Usability.gov
website has some examples. The examples are NOT about people with
disabilities, as far as I know, but they'll give you a good idea how it all
works.  


This will link you to the section about personas:
http://www.usability.gov/templates/index.html#personas

This is a link to all of the site's templates and examples, including
consent forms:

http://www.usability.gov/templates/

There are other good resources out there- I've bookmarked a few on my other
computer.

 Michelle probably is the best source for this!

-Lynn Marentette


TechPsych 
Interactive Multimedia Technology

-----Original Message-----
From: games_access-bounces at igda.org [mailto:games_access-bounces at igda.org]
On Behalf Of games_access-request at igda.org
Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 4:45 AM
To: games_access at igda.org
Subject: games_access Digest, Vol 35, Issue 45

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Today's Topics:

   1. More persona stuff (d. michelle hinn)
   2. Re: Ideas for GDC 2008 (Barrie Ellis)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 00:23:13 -0500
From: "d. michelle hinn" <hinn at uiuc.edu>
Subject: [games_access] More persona stuff
To: IGDA Games Accessibility SIG Mailing List <games_access at igda.org>
Message-ID: <p06230943c27c2263d3ea@[130.126.29.84]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"

I can also add what I know about scenario-based design -- let's start
working on this on the wiki. I'll carve out a place for us to start writing
up our stories.

I'm leaning toward cartoon images -- like a superhero gamer who is blind but
has amazing hearing, etc. I think that would fit in better with the game
conference. But I'm also struggling with the images of real people -- we'd
need to do some major legal rights stuff to use their images.

Michelle

>Hi Lynn,
>
>That would be great! Even if it was only to give disabilities a more 
>human face. What I'm saying is that game developers probably sympathize 
>more with seeing an actual person with a disability than with something 
>abstract like: " cognitive limitation"
>
>Should we use images of real people (don't want to violate someone's 
>privacy or image rights) or shall we use cartoonlike images?
>
>Cheers Eelke
>
>
>
>
>On 5/24/07, Lynn Marentette <lynnvm at carolina.rr.com> wrote:
>>Eelke - and games access members -
>>
>>I been lurking most of the time on this list, because I've been so 
>>busy with work and school.
>>
>>I took a graduate-level Human-Computer Interaction class last semester 
>>and spent some  time developing "personas" for part of a project.
>>
>>I would be happy to work on some personas that would benefit the cause.
>>
>>I'm not sure if you remember me, but I'm a school psychologist who 
>>works with students who have a range of abilities and disabilities. (I 
>>chose the topic of Universal Usability for my class presentation.)
>>
>>Lynn Marentette
>>
>>TechPsych
>>Interactive Multimedia Technology
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: games_access-bounces at igda.org 
>>[mailto:games_access-bounces at igda.org]
>>On Behalf Of games_access-request at igda.org
>>Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2007 7:13 PM
>>To: games_access at igda.org
>>Subject: games_access Digest, Vol 35, Issue 37
>>
>>Send games_access mailing list submissions to
>>         games_access at igda.org
>>
>>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>         http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
>>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>         games_access-request at igda.org
>>
>>You can reach the person managing the list at
>>         games_access-owner at igda.org
>>
>>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific 
>>than
>>"Re: Contents of games_access digest..."
>>
>>
>>Today's Topics:
>>
>>    1. persona (Eelke Folmer)
>>    2. Re: Game Accessibility Conference (Eelke Folmer)
>>    3. Re: Game Accessibility Conference (Reid Kimball)
>>    4. Re: E for All (Eelke Folmer)
>>
>>
>>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>Message: 1
>>Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 14:32:32 -0700
>>From: Eelke Folmer <eelke.folmer at gmail.com>
>>Subject: [games_access] persona
>>To: IGDA Games Accessibility SIG Mailing List <games_access at igda.org>
>>Message-ID: <8432A0B2-A11B-48A4-93D3-B92CDCC5A553 at gmail.com>
>>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed";
>>         DelSp="yes"
>>
>>Hi,
>>
>>I had an idea that I picked up a while ago while I was at CHI 2006 
>>last year, I found it last week while going through old notes. At
>>Chi2006 there was a talk on microsoft office and one of the 
>>interaction designers showed how microsoft uses  persona' to help design
software. E.g.
>>there would be a grandma called betty (making these names up) who 
>>would use word to write a letter to her son.
>>There would be a 12 year old schoolgirl called emma who would use word 
>>to write a school paper on dinosaurs. There would be a 'dad' who would 
>>use excel to calculate car payments.  etc etc, there were about
>>6 of these personas on big signs with a name, a photo, some of their 
>>hobbies and some sentences indicating how they would use a particular 
>>Microsoft application. (i'm not exactly sure what was on there). They 
>>would hang these persona's as posters in offices in microsoft so the 
>>developers would be aware for who they were designing for. At some 
>>point they would not notice the posters any more but these persona's 
>>were very much embedded in the development of software and were always 
>>references in discussions. E.g. they would consider adding a 
>>complicated feature in excel that could help dad more easy but that 
>>would also make the interface more difficult for tommie, etc etc.
>>
>>I was wondering whether we could do the same for disabilities? If we 
>>can actually provide developers 4-6 persona (covering most
>>disabilities) I think it would be an helpful tool which can facilitate 
>>discussion and will also allow more clearly to focus the development 
>>of a game to include disabilities.
>>
>>I was thinking of doing it for my collection of patterns already 
>>because i think its just more personable to develop for "blind bettie" 
>>and show a picture of a girl that is actually blind than just use "visual
impairments".
>>
>>Any ideas/thoughts on this?
>>
>>cheers Eelke
>>
>>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>--
>>----
>>Eelke Folmer                                          Assistant
>>Professor
>>Department of Computer Science &       Engineering/171
>>University of Nevada                         Reno, Nevada 89557
>>Game Quality                   usability|accessibility.eelke.com
>>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>--
>>----
>>
>>
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>>------------------------------
>>
>>Message: 2
>>Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 14:33:26 -0700
>>From: Eelke Folmer <eelke.folmer at gmail.com>
>>Subject: Re: [games_access] Game Accessibility Conference
>>To: IGDA Games Accessibility SIG Mailing List <games_access at igda.org>
>>Message-ID: <BFEAD234-967B-40A8-96F3-5F379A0B7541 at gmail.com>
>>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed";
>>         DelSp="yes"
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>>Hi,
>>
>>The idea of a conference focusing on game accessibility is great but 
>>I'm kind of concerned whether we will be able to attract an audience for
it.
>>What is the goal? 'spreading the word' e.g. convincing game developers 
>>of the importance of making games accessible? or or do we target our 
>>fellow researchers and discuss & explore new ways of making games more 
>>accessible and putting accessibility on the roadmap of developers?
>>
>>I think it is important to distinguish between these goals.
>>
>>cheers Eelke
>>
>>
>>
>>On May 20, 2007, at 12:01 PM, d. michelle hinn wrote:
>>
>>>  Hi all,
>>>
>>>  So I've mentioned this before but we should probably start 
>>> discussing  it for real. The IGDA would like to support our efforts 
>>> in creating a  one-day conference on Game Accessibility. Now this 
>>> could be something  attached to another conference (like GDC) or on it's
own as a "summit"
>>>  at a time where we aren't so frazzled from GDC.
>>>
>>>  This is one of the things I'll be bringing up at the online 
>>> meetings  this week so I'd appreciate ideas for location, dates, how 
>>> wide we  cast the net (ie, do we personally court a person from 
>>> every major  game company we can to attend), do we want it to be 
>>> small the first  year and then cast the net wider the next year?
>>>
>>>  What are your thoughts? Basically the IGDA now has a group that 
>>> does  conference/summit set ups for us so we tell them what we want 
>>> and they  deal with the registration, hotel block reservations, 
>>> venue, some  advertising, etc. So that's what make it's a very cool
opportunity!
>>>
>>>  Michelle
>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>  games_access mailing list
>>>  games_access at igda.org
>>>  http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
>>
>>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>--
>>----
>>Eelke Folmer                                          Assistant
>>Professor
>>Department of Computer Science &       Engineering/171
>>University of Nevada                         Reno, Nevada 89557
>>Game Quality                   usability|accessibility.eelke.com
>>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>--
>>----
>>
>>
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>>------------------------------
>>
>>Message: 3
>>Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 14:59:21 -0700
>>From: "Reid Kimball" <reid at rbkdesign.com>
>>Subject: Re: [games_access] Game Accessibility Conference
>>To: "IGDA Games Accessibility SIG Mailing List"
>>         <games_access at igda.org>
>>Message-ID:
>>         <a6673b8d0705231459q7dd47421l99ec7a81d655d53d at mail.gmail.com>
>>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>>
>>"I'm kind of concerned whether we will be able to attract an audience 
>>for it" I think the first GDC had 7 attendees. We shouldn't put 
>>unrealistic pressure on ourselves with our first conference to bring 
>>in huge numbers or big names. The other questions you ask are right.
>>If it's a conference, I'd want to see some sessions geared towards the 
>>academic/research crowd talking about ways to improve accessibility 
>>and others geared to developers talking about the practical 
>>implementations that work now.
>>
>>On 5/23/07, Eelke Folmer <eelke.folmer at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>  Hi,
>>>
>>>  The idea of a conference focusing on game accessibility is great 
>>> but  I'm kind of concerned whether we will be able to attract an 
>>> audience for
>>it.
>>>  What is the goal? 'spreading the word' e.g. convincing game 
>>> developers  of the importance of making games accessible? or or do 
>>> we target our  fellow researchers and discuss & explore new ways of 
>>> making games more  accessible and putting accessibility on the roadmap
of developers?
>>>
>>>  I think it is important to distinguish between these goals.
>>>
>>>  cheers Eelke
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>  On May 20, 2007, at 12:01 PM, d. michelle hinn wrote:
>>>
>>>  Hi all,
>>>
>>>  So I've mentioned this before but we should probably start 
>>> discussing  it for real. The IGDA would like to support our efforts 
>>> in creating a  one-day conference on Game Accessibility. Now this 
>>> could be something  attached to another conference (like GDC) or on it's
own as a "summit"
>>>  at a time where we aren't so frazzled from GDC.
>>>
>>>  This is one of the things I'll be bringing up at the online 
>>> meetings  this week so I'd appreciate ideas for location, dates, how 
>>> wide we  cast the net (ie, do we personally court a person from 
>>> every major  game company we can to attend), do we want it to be 
>>> small the first  year and then cast the net wider the next year?
>>>
>>>  What are your thoughts? Basically the IGDA now has a group that 
>>> does  conference/summit set ups for us so we tell them what we want 
>>> and they  deal with the registration, hotel block reservations, 
>>> venue, some  advertising, etc. So that's what make it's a very cool
opportunity!
>>>
>>>  Michelle
>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>  games_access mailing list
>>>  games_access at igda.org
>>>  http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
>>>
>>>
>>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>------
>>>  Eelke Folmer                                          Assistant
Professor
>>>  Department of Computer Science &       Engineering/171
>>>  University of Nevada                         Reno, Nevada 89557
>>>  Game Quality
>>>  usability|accessibility.eelke.com
>>>  
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> --
>>>  ------
>>>
>>>
>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>  games_access mailing list
>>>  games_access at igda.org
>>>  http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>------------------------------
>>
>>Message: 4
>>Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 16:12:29 -0700
>>From: "Eelke Folmer" <eelke.folmer at gmail.com>
>>Subject: Re: [games_access] E for All
>>To: "IGDA Games Accessibility SIG Mailing List"
>>         <games_access at igda.org>
>>Message-ID:
>>         <836db6300705231612g9790ae9v8ef057e9d031f55f at mail.gmail.com>
>>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>>
>>Hi,
>>
>>I have the funds to go. I could go but I'll probably be busy with
teaching.
>>By the way, i have all the accessibility equipment (e.g. quad 
>>controller, one handed joysticks & stuff, still need to order some one
>>button) so we don't have to ship it from the UK.
>>
>>cheers eelke
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>On 5/22/07, Reid Kimball <reid at rbkdesign.com> wrote:
>>>  There's a possibility I could attend as it's on the west coast.
>>>  There's another conference I'll probably attend in Oct, will send 
>>> an
>>  > email about it soon.
>>>
>>>  -Reid
>>>
>>>  On 5/22/07, d. michelle hinn <hinn at uiuc.edu> wrote:
>>>  > Yes, couple that with a booth at GDC...for the first time we'll 
>>> have  > the chance to really get the word on the street! Or at least 
>>> the  > 'net. :)  >  > >wow! that will be THE Arcade! Excellent 
>>> /Thomas  > >  > >  > >22 maj 2007 kl. 21.04 skrev d. michelle hinn:
>>>  > >
>>>  > >>but free of charge booth. Ac
>>>  > >>
>>>  > >
>>>  > >__________________________________
>>>  > >Thomas Westin
>>>  > >VD / CEO
>>>  > >
>>>  > >Pin Interactive AB
>>>  > >:: Digital Culture Analysis :: Tools :: Worlds  > 
>>> >__________________________________
>>>  > >Award Winning Developer
>>>  > >www.pininteractive.com
>>>  > >
>>>  > >
>>>  > >
>>>  > >_______________________________________________
>>>  > >games_access mailing list
>>>  > >games_access at igda.org
>>>  > >http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
>>>  >
>>>  > _______________________________________________
>>>  > games_access mailing list
>>>  > games_access at igda.org
>>>  > http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
>>>  >
>>>  _______________________________________________
>>>  games_access mailing list
>>>  games_access at igda.org
>>>  http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
>>>
>>
>>
>>--
>>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
>>Eelke Folmer                           Assistant Professor
>>Department of CS&E/171
>>University of Nevada              Reno, Nevada 89557
>>Game interaction design        www.helpyouplay.com
>>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>------
>>
>>
>>------------------------------
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>games_access mailing list
>>games_access at igda.org
>>http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
>>
>>
>>End of games_access Digest, Vol 35, Issue 37
>>********************************************
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>games_access mailing list
>>games_access at igda.org
>>http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access
>>
>
>
>--
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
>Eelke Folmer                           Assistant Professor
>Department of CS&E/171
>University of Nevada              Reno, Nevada 89557
>Game interaction design        www.helpyouplay.com
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>----- _______________________________________________
>games_access mailing list
>games_access at igda.org
>http://seven.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/games_access



------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 09:44:31 +0100
From: "Barrie Ellis" <barrie.ellis at oneswitch.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [games_access] Ideas for GDC 2008
To: "IGDA Games Accessibility SIG Mailing List"
	<games_access at igda.org>
Message-ID: <03d301c79ea8$ed0c0230$0302a8c0 at OneSwitch>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

I think this kind of thing can be effective. I know in this country D.A.N.
(The Disability Action Network) handcuffed themselves to buses and the
railings of parliament when they were protesting about the lack of access in
public transport. I would say that transport is now a lot better in this
country - not solely for their protests - but I think they helped sway
oppinion. D.A.N. is very quiet/non-existant these days - but many of the
activists from D.A.N. got absorbed by councils and so on with jobs where
they could make changes from within. It would be great if more disabled
people started to get jobs out of a GDC campaign and could make a difference
in a similar way.

Barrie
www.OneSwitch.org.uk

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Eelke Folmer
  To: IGDA Games Accessibility SIG Mailing List
  Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 3:09 AM
  Subject: Re: [games_access] Ideas for GDC 2008


  Hi all,


  I think I pitched this idea sometime ago when we were having this big
conflict ;-) but I'd like to pitch it again because I seriously would like
you guys to consider this. 


  It's pretty obvious after the low turnouts of our events that game
developers are just not interested in what we have to say so why don't we do
something more rebellious and just shove the facts in their face? My idea
for next year's GDC would be to stand right outside the Moscone center
(between the north and west pavilion where at least 5000 game developers
walk by) with a number of disabled people holding signs saying WE WANT
ACCESSIBLE GAMES.  If we really want to get attention I think this is what
we should do. At the same time we can hand out small flyers. Lets make four
different little flyers (so people can collect or trade them ;-) (combine it
with the persona idea)  for each disability one little flyer which obviously
states a) a problem b) a solution(s).  E.g. "tim" is a quadripleghic, sees
gears of war on tv all the time but can't play it because it doesn't support
his quad controller (maybe not use names of existing games not to piss of
epic studios). Solutions
  :  "allow configurable keys and map actions to different buttons & use
autoaim to minimize the amount of interaction".


  I don't know if you would be into this, or whether it would be appropriate
but I think its an idea at least worth exploring. 


  Cheers Eelke








  On May 23, 2007, at 1:25 PM, d. michelle hinn wrote:


    The main thing to consider (worry about) is that the fewer sessions we
have (and the expo doesn't count), the fewer passes we get that allow us to
get into the main part of GDC. So we reallllly have to think about the
number of sessions we could realistically do (and perhaps this means that
the SIG sponsors sessions that are meant for, say, "research on
accessibility" that just a few people take and run with). So...I need to be
tricky...er...innovative. ;)


    Michelle


      I like something along these lines for a GDC session title,


      Innovation: True Next Generation Gameplay for Everyone


      However, it risks sounding like marketing hype and devs see right
      through that. Anyway, this could be our "wow that's cool shit" type of
      presentation where we talk about the Demor sound based game for the
      blind and Brain Fingers and the Haptic device. We try to make this as
      flashy and cool as possible, even if tech isn't 100% there or games
      widely available. It should be entertaining for people who like to see
      what's around the corner and educational in showing people that there
      are those with disabilities that can't play their current games.


      Aside from that, I'd like to try the Expo booth more than a GDC
      session. There's only a few ways I can talk about closed captioning
      and I think I've tried them all.


      -Reid






      On 5/21/07, d. michelle hinn <hinn at uiuc.edu> wrote:
        Ok...so now's the time to get the write ups going for the proposed
        SIG sessions for GDC 2008 (it always takes us a bit to get things
        finalized and GDC is even earlier in 2008) and I some ideas that I
        want to run past people.


        We've talked a lot already about applying accessibility to how it
        would help people that don't have a disability (like curb cuts that
        help bicyclists and parents with baby strollers, etc). What if we
had
        a session called "Innovation: Game Accessibility for Able Gamers"
        with the session planned around taking what we know about
        accessibility and targeted the solutions for the "abled" in order to
        help them out by taking them out of the lull of "boring, predictable
        gaming"? This would be a session for the really "out there" stuff
        like biofeedback and games like demor. When I presented at last
        year's Montreal Game Summit, I found that it was the "wow" stuff
that
        got people thinking about the whole issue of accessibility being
        "cool" -- it was the carrot that got them to listen to the more
basic
        design information. After that, people came up to talk to me about
        how they never thought about accessibility as NOT limiting game
        design.


        I'm not totally sold on the title (I just came up with it now so
        catchier titles would be greatly appreciated!) but it would give us
a
        way to present accessibility information pertaining to disabled
        gamers, sell it as something that helps more than just disabled
        gamers without straying too far from the fact that we are the game
        accessibility SIG.


        Another thing to think about is not how gamers is with disabilities
        are limited but, instead, how maybe the increased skill in another
        area makes them even MORE competitive and so "able" gamers should
        know about these -- it's a turn around of telling them what they are
        doing RIGHT in games by pointing out that they could even the score
        with regard to accessibility by keeping these things in their games
        (I know...that last one's trickier because it could lead to a
        developer thinking that they are unbalanced in their gameplay by
        making things easier for one user group...even though they already
do
        that when they are INaccessible).


        I've seen how easy some find it to forget the original audience that
        a design was aiming for by making changes that end up not serving
        that original audience. So that's why I remain resistant to totally
        taking the word "accessibility" out -- I'm afraid of NOT reminding
        the industry to keep gamers with disabilities in mind because it's
so
        easy for them to come down with selective amnesia. We've tried a LOT
        of tactics over the years -- from serious to humorous, from
        roundtables to much more ambitious workshops. So we need to think
        about what we've learned from the four years we've presented as a
SIG
        at GDC. We won't do "accessibility idol" again but I think we
        *should* do another competition (and we can again -- we got the
        tentative "thumbs up" to do an hour-long competition, rather than
the
        two hour overkill). I'll write another email about ideas for a
        competition that removes us from "idol" but helps us better make
        accessibility into a challenging creative design process rather than
        this "forced, non-creative" thing that it's rumored to be (and this
        year I know to jump on the signage and web advert issue
immediately).


        BUT...as a SIG I think we should stick to a fun competition (with
the
        devs that showed interest last year but couldn't do it but can this
        year), the expo (with the fall back of another "arcade" thing, only
        not three days worth), a "wacky session" like "innovation," and some
        sort of longer session (like a tutorial) where we can have "short
        burst" info about the things that SIG members have been doing -- ie,
        Eelke might take 20-30 minutes to discuss his stuff, Dimitris taking
        the same amount of time to overview his latest, Barrie and his
stuff,
        etc, etc, etc. Then if any one person wants to do a longer
        presentation on their own stuff, they can do so at their own
session,
        promoting it at the SIG workshop. And if it helps, we can present
the
        more solo-acts as SIG-sponsored sessions to make sure it gets on the
        schedule better -- I know Reid and others have had a really hard
time
        getting onto the schedule as solo acts. But in the end the longer
        presentations would be the onus of the person who is presenting
their
        work and not something that the entire SIG needs to be there to set
        up for, etc (that doesn't mean that we all wouldn't try to be there
        for them!!).


        We learned in March that 78.4 SIG sessions (ok, 8) isn't the way to
        go but I also think going back to the single roundtable isn't the
        answer either. So now we have to find our happy medium that allows
us
        to all ATTEND other sessions and help increase the buzz about all of
        our sessions, our existance, etc but also maximize our limited
        (simply by the fact that there are just a few of us that can make it
        to any one GDC) efforts in the sessions that we do. And we have to
        find our happy medium so it's not just a couple of us pulling
        all-nighters the weeks before! So instead of me being in charge of
        every session for the organization, we can share the wealth a bit by
        having some on the committee for the competition, others on the
        tutorial/workshop committee, and so forth. I realize that we aren't
a
        big lot but even NON attendees can help serve on committees to help
        share ideas!


        Ok that's the end of this email that had started out short and
sweet.
        :) Sorry -- just feeling the GDC pressure and I realllly want to get
        as many people involved as possible so we can present a more united
        effort and help best support one another!!


        Thoughts? Reactions? And, yes, I'm now very removed from the
emotions
        of GDC 2007. :) But please be thoughtful in your suggestions --
        underneath that black leather jacket I keep wearing to GDCs (for
good
        luck?), I can get rather down sometimes (yay! depression!) and I'd
        hate for us to have a flame war. I promise I will count to 10 before
        hitting the "send" button if I find myself taking things too
        personally. Ok, deal? :)


        Michelle
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----------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Eelke Folmer                                          Assistant Professor
  Department of Computer Science &       Engineering/171
  University of Nevada                         Reno, Nevada 89557
  Game Quality                   usability|accessibility.eelke.com
 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------






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